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Original article: Entrevista a Nicolás Poblete: «La necesidad de buscar líderes es preocupante porque habla de la pobreza espiritual en la que nos hallamos»

Séptima región, the latest novel by Nicolás Poblete published by Editorial Cuarto Propio, delves into the dynamics of seduction, dependency, and submission that can emerge within a cult.

The narrative follows Renato, an occupational therapist who, after the death of his wife, goes through a profound personal crisis that leads him to accept an invitation from Eneas, an old colleague who has chosen an ascetic lifestyle in a rural area of Maule.

This relationship propels the novel into themes of mourning, guilt, the search for meaning, and the complex power dynamics that can develop between a guide and his disciple.

Nicolás Poblete is a Chilean writer known for his significant narrative works, including novels like Succión, No me ignores, Subterfugio, and Corral. In Séptima región, he revisits themes related to human fragility, identity, and how people cope with extreme situations.

In an interview with El Ciudadano, Poblete reflects on several debates woven throughout the novel and their contemporary resonance: vulnerability as fertile ground for manipulation, the rise of charismatic leadership, the crisis of traditional political narratives, the impact of social media, and the growing longing for belonging in a society marked by uncertainty and abandonment.

–In the novel, Eneas constructs an alternative truth that ultimately overrides Renato’s reality. Do you believe we live in an era where narratives matter more than facts?

I hadn’t thought of it in those terms, but it’s true that masks have taken on a significant role; they even replace identities, as evidenced on social media where a bot can seem real, and an account can host multiple “personas” in a dramatic sense.

Indeed, sometimes an alternative offering prevails, and the disciple—or in another context, the voter or member of an entity—»buys» that narrative and becomes a follower or convert. This is what we currently witness, where it’s challenging to distinguish between “community” and “consumers.”

–Traditional left and right political parties are experiencing a legitimacy crisis in many countries. Are sects and charismatic leaders occupying the space once held by political projects?

That’s true. Today, political poles seem negligible in the sense that authoritarianism crosses boundaries: popular notions like “left-wing fascists” or “poor fascists” indicate an intellectual poverty we face amidst the harshest capitalism, which impacts all sectors.

Thus, it’s no surprise that many seek to express their convictions and even values in alternative spaces, which often leads to further fragmentation of commitments. These are leaders who promise a supposedly less contaminated welcome. In fact, they often present themselves as purified innovations, but time eventually reveals their true nature.

-Do you see Eneas as a political figure in addition to a spiritual one?

Yes, he is primarily a political figure because of his rhetoric. He denounces the abuses faced by other species under man’s command. Everything he articulates makes sense because no one can reasonably disagree with the terrible reality our planet is enduring on numerous levels, starting with the ecological.

At one point, he mentions that during the digitization of materials for a university library, staff simply throw books away. This is an example of how we can use a concrete fact to advance our political discourse, which Eneas transforms into a spiritual narrative.

-The novel suggests that vulnerability can be fertile ground for manipulation. What collective vulnerabilities do you observe in Chilean society today?

Absolutely. Vulnerability can be a fleeting state, but it can also be long-lasting. Not everyone realizes how exposed they are and how susceptible they are to manipulation by various discourses or applications.

This requires a more sociological perspective to account for what’s happening at a community level. However, the exposure in which we live, the vulnerability of our society, is transparent. At a high level, we see that the current president won the elections decisively, yet his approval has plummeted in just three months. This exemplifies how volatile public will can be, especially when education has been dismantled from its foundations.

-Eneas gets injured during the social uprising. Why was it important for you that the origin of his transformation be linked to this historical moment?

It wasn’t deliberate, but I did think about the flags. So many flags during the uprising, some spontaneous, some original. In the novel, we see that Eneas needs to find an incredibly expensive remedy for his son’s epilepsy treatment, and the narrative voice comments that there’s no flag for his demand. The narrative also offers an anti-heroic lens through which to view the uprising.

In the novel, Eneas is hit in the face by a tear gas canister because he protects a masked girl, and it is she who ends up stealing his bounty.

-Can Séptima región be interpreted as a metaphor for the spaces that arise when the State, politics, or traditional communities fail to contain individuals?

That’s correct. It is a metaphor for the helplessness we all experience, to varying degrees. It reflects the collapse of various institutions and narratives, and it’s in this context that alternatives start to emerge to call together or accommodate communities disillusioned by these ideologies, such as Renato, whose background is Catholic. He doesn’t articulate disappointment towards the ecclesiastical institution; he lacks the resources for such an evaluation, but he intuits something is wrong, and it’s at this point he allows himself to be swayed by the persuasive and successful hypnosis that Eneas represents.

-Eneas’s ecological discourse has a real and legitimate basis. Were you interested in exploring how just causes can turn into mechanisms of domination?

Yes, in Eneas’s case, he has appropriated this discourse to carry out his own pilgrimage. He has an agenda that goes beyond the ecological reflection, which in itself makes a lot of sense. That’s why it’s difficult for Renato to listen critically. In fact, he isn’t even capable of critical thinking. He acts as a true receptacle for these dogmas, a body that internalizes these proclamations with strength and speed, as he is in a very subordinate, compliant position.

-The novel seems to pose an uncomfortable question: do we truly want to be free, or do we sometimes prefer to have someone tell us what to do?

That question is very dangerous because it places you at an abyss. What is the cost of freedom? What does it entail?

I return to the crisis in education. You can have the freedom to vote for a particular candidate, but if you don’t even know where their discourse originates, is your freedom genuine?

Personally, I believe that freedom is not granted by the State or society; rather, it is a fluid, ongoing psychic search. They are subjective attainments that cannot be quantified, but they do manifest gradually as a critical stance against conformity.

-Do social media democratize information or multiply the small Eneas figures?

As Tristan Harris, the former ethical designer at Google, has acknowledged, social media are deliberately designed to hijack human attention and manipulate behavior. The priority here is monetary profit and not the mental well-being of its users. It’s a simulacrum of democracy. Gurus, also known as influencers, arise within them.

Tristan Harris has also admitted that the promises of democratization, social connectivity, and inclusiveness have rather conspicuously failed, and he considers today’s youth as “the loneliest generation,” a concept he himself coined.

-After writing Séptima región, what concerns you more: the existence of manipulative leaders or the growing social need to find them?

The need to seek them out is indeed troubling because it speaks to the spiritual poverty in which we find ourselves. I’m not referring to anything esoteric, but to access to education and how the population has been dulled by slogans and spurious promises that exploit a sad hedonism marketed as “freedom.”

La entrada Interview with Nicolás Poblete: «The Need to Find Leaders is Troubling as It Reflects Our Spiritual Poverty» se publicó primero en El Ciudadano.